1355537242 M * Bertl off to bed now ... have a good one everyone!
1355537247 N * Bertl Bertl_zZ
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1355557825 J * Romster ~romster@202.168.100.149.dynamic.rev.eftel.com
1355558857 J * fisted ~fisted@xdsl-87-78-181-191.netcologne.de
1355562114 J * Ghislain ~aqueos@adsl1.aqueos.com
1355563088 J * Aiken ~Aiken@2001:44b8:2168:1000:21f:d0ff:fed6:d63f
1355564201 J * bonbons ~bonbons@2001:960:7ab:0:2109:de22:c4ed:fd37
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1355569268 J * fisted ~fisted@xdsl-78-35-83-222.netcologne.de
1355569850 J * Jevermeister ~Jever@77-22-254-55-dynip.superkabel.de
1355569891 M * Jevermeister hi guys. i currently have ubuntu 10.04 64bit running on a VPS (which is a linux-vserver container, the host is running 64bit) and i want to install 12.04
1355569911 M * Jevermeister but as i don't have much available memory, i thought about installing 12.04 32bit. 
1355569939 M * Jevermeister linux-vserver is just a chroot container as far as i know - so would i use less memory in my vps? aparently not?
1355570334 M * Guy- Jevermeister: this is a relatively complex question
1355570358 M * Guy- Jevermeister: if you have two 64bit guests, they can share much of in-memory code
1355570377 M * Guy- Jevermeister: so installing a 32bit guest would likely cost more memory than an additional 64bit guest
1355570397 M * Guy- Jevermeister: otoh, if you only have one guest (or only 32bit guests), a 32bit guest is going to cost you less memory
1355570414 M * Jevermeister mmh okay... as i bought this vps and don't have access to the host
1355570431 M * Jevermeister but i think most of the other VPS on this server will be 64bit
1355570515 M * Jevermeister so my vps uses less memory if it can share the code?
1355570520 M * Jevermeister or the host uses less memory
1355570707 N * Bertl_zZ Bertl
1355570708 M * Jevermeister because maybe it is nice for my VPS provider that they use less memory but if i still get the memory accounted to my vps i have no use from it
1355570714 M * Bertl morning folks!
1355570720 M * Jevermeister morning
1355570794 M * Bertl the question is even more complex than it seems :)
1355570816 M * Bertl first, sharing completely depends on the host setup and the actual kernel used
1355570841 M * Jevermeister hmpf
1355570852 M * Bertl i.e. if the guests are not unified, there will be no sharing between the guests, and thus no benefit (memory wise) for either you or the hoster
1355570898 M * Jevermeister dunno. it is a VPS from edis.at , uname -a: Linux XXX 2.6.32-5-vserver-amd64 #1 SMP Mon Jan 16 19:31:31 UTC 2012 x86_64 GNU/Linux
1355570903 M * Bertl assuming that the sharing (between guests) is not of any benefit to you, because it either doesn't happen or doesn't give you any advantage (different guest system, accounting, etc)
1355570918 M * Jevermeister mmh okay
1355570926 M * Bertl we are left with 32bit userspace vs 64bit userspace
1355570941 M * Jevermeister so i should install 64bit ubuntu as i won't profit from 32bit memory savings
1355570956 M * Bertl naturally 64bit pointers and integers take more space than 32bit
1355570979 M * Jevermeister i know. thought about this as i found out that linux-vserver is more a chroot than a virtualisation
1355570981 M * Bertl the virtual memory structures and the in kernel structures will be 64bit, as the host is running a 64bit kernel
1355571002 M * Bertl (otherwise you wouldn't be able to run 64bit guests)
1355571035 M * Bertl so, to preserve memory (from the guest PoV) you need to compare the size of the userspace libraries you are using
1355571067 M * Bertl i.e. check what libraries get used, check what size they have (in memory) for 32 and 64 bit and pick the one which is smaller
1355571086 M * Bertl (of course, you'll need to optimize that over all processes/applications/etc)
1355571093 M * daniel_hozac depending on whether size is what you care about most
1355571121 M * Bertl yeah, well, he was worried about the memory usage
1355571124 M * Jevermeister just wondered because i have another vps which is running 12.04 32bit ubuntu
1355571125 M * daniel_hozac x86_64 is usually faster for doing any kind of computations.
1355571154 M * Jevermeister and if i compare memory usage, my 32bit openvz vps uses way less memory
1355571165 M * Jevermeister even if their host is 64but as they offer 64bit installations
1355571196 M * Bertl so you did compare a 32bit OVZ vs a 64bit OVZ installation already?
1355571205 M * Jevermeister nope
1355571243 M * Bertl well, then I'd be careful with jumping to conclusions, as the memory shown for a guest is the result from accounting done in the kernel
1355571263 M * Bertl and I wouldn't be surprised if OVZ does accounting in a quite different way
1355571280 M * Bertl so do not compare this with mainline or Linux-VServer 
1355571309 M * Bertl but, good news: just convert the existing OVZ guest to Linux-VServer and test run it on the 64bit system
1355571312 M * Jevermeister okay. can't change the fact that i'm using linux-vserver on my vps 
1355571324 M * Bertl then you have a rough comparison of 32bit vs 64bit on the new host
1355571326 M * Jevermeister i bought the VPS and don't own the host node
1355571333 M * Bertl so?
1355571369 M * Jevermeister but i only have 512mb ram available on my linux-vserver vps and need to install 12.04
1355571399 M * Jevermeister and saw that my 32bit openvz vps uses way less memory than my linux-vserver vps and thought about installing 32bit 12.04
1355571415 M * Jevermeister wasn't sure about that and asked here :)
1355571437 M * Bertl you can easily test drive that at home if you like
1355571532 M * Bertl 2.6.32-5-vserver-amd64 looks like the default distro kernel, install that e.g. in a kvm, and try both (32bit and 64bit) guests
1355571555 M * Bertl you can even fine tune that at home and then upload your optimized guest to the hosting vps
1355571573 M * Jevermeister can't upload custom guests
1355571580 M * Jevermeister just have a list to choose from
1355571594 M * Bertl you don't have root access on the guest?
1355571600 Q * ircuser-1 Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1355571601 M * Jevermeister sure i have
1355571613 M * Bertl then you can upload whatever you like
1355571628 M * Bertl (it just has to match the configured init style)
1355571632 M * Jevermeister but i can't change a running system as far as i know?
1355571655 M * Bertl you simply rsync stuff to the guest, and switch directories, then reboot
1355571670 M * Bertl (i.e. restart the guest)
1355571679 M * Jevermeister hmm. could be a way to migrate my current vps
1355571688 M * Bertl you can test this at home as well :)
1355571714 M * Bertl that's one advantage of a free/open source isolation technology
1355571793 M * Jevermeister :)
1355574762 M * Bertl daniel_hozac: when you get around, could you take a look at the uapi changes and if the 'new' headers suit your/util-vservers purpose?
1355574980 M * Jevermeister graah. forgot to backup my mysql database
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1355575935 J * ensc|w ~ensc@www.sigma-chemnitz.de
1355576674 N * ensc Guest1559
1355576684 J * ensc ~irc-ensc@p54ADEAA1.dip.t-dialin.net
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1355577730 J * sannes ~ace@cm-84.211.93.82.getinternet.no
1355578722 M * Bertl off for now ... bbl
1355578726 N * Bertl Bertl_oO
1355582316 J * ircuser-1 ~ircuser-1@35.222-62-69.ftth.swbr.surewest.net
1355583450 J * isAAAc ~isaaac@2a01:6600:8081:3701:c98:61ff:fe65:cbf8
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1355589095 J * fisted_ ~fisted@xdsl-78-35-83-222.netcologne.de
1355589125 Q * fisted Remote host closed the connection
1355589125 N * fisted_ fisted
1355589728 M * disposable Bertl_oO: finally got serial in virtualbox to work. I compiled a vanilla 3.7, applied the patch and captured the whole bootup/panic. http://pastebin.com/8uS1j1HD  I'll compile another kernel with the spinlock debug module and post that too.
1355590712 N * Bertl_oO Bertl
1355590715 M * Bertl back now ...
1355590738 M * Bertl disposable: good, now please run the addresses [<...>] through addr2line -e vmlinux
1355590774 M * Bertl and annotate the call trace with the file names and line numbers
1355591130 M * disposable Bertl: how do i do that if the kernel doesn't even boot?
1355591173 M * Bertl you cd to the kernel build tree, and there run addr2line -e vmlinux ...
1355591184 M * Bertl where ... are the addresses listed in the stack dump
1355592105 M * disposable lines 352-363 in http://pastebin.com/8uS1j1HD translate to http://pastebin.com/UWuF8s9U
1355592210 M * disposable line 365 is kvm.c:0 and line 366 is ??:0
1355592708 M * Bertl well, looks like your kernel is somehow missing the debug info, check the config, and if necessary recompile with debug info enabled
1355594129 M * disposable yes, that kernel was without debug info. i've compiled another  with debug in but i won't have time to run it until monday. i have to go now.
1355594241 M * Bertl no problem, doesn't really look Linux-VServer related to me anyway
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1355599048 J * hijacker_ ~hijacker@cable-84-43-134-121.mnet.bg
1355599554 M * Bertl off for a nap .. bbl
1355599559 N * Bertl Bertl_zZ
1355601778 J * Aiken ~Aiken@2001:44b8:2168:1000:21f:d0ff:fed6:d63f
1355604541 Q * isAAAc Quit: Konversation terminated!
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1355609111 N * Bertl_zZ Bertl
1355609117 M * Bertl back now ...
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1355610026 Q * hijacker_ Read error: Connection reset by peer
1355611098 J * Romster ~romster@202.168.100.149.dynamic.rev.eftel.com
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1355612469 J * fisted ~fisted@xdsl-87-78-187-161.netcologne.de
1355614874 Q * bonbons Quit: Leaving