1318377968 Q * Hunger Quit: _._
1318378191 J * Hunger ~Hunger@Hunger.hu
1318385276 J * hparker ~hparker@2001:470:1f0f:32c:beae:c5ff:fe01:b647
1318388232 M * Bertl off to bed now ... have a good one everyone!
1318388237 N * Bertl Bertl_zZ
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1318397252 J * derjohn_foo ~aj@213.238.45.2
1318398901 J * ncopa ~ncopa@3.203.202.84.customer.cdi.no
1318399772 M * arekm Bertl_zZ: don't know actually (mine kernels are heavily patched, so I usually have to fix things by hand)
1318402471 J * ghislain ~AQUEOS@adsl2.aqueos.com
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1318405610 J * fisted ~fisted@xdsl-87-78-221-97.netcologne.de
1318408079 J * kir ~kir@swsoft-msk-nat.sw.ru
1318411039 J * trapni ~trapni@trapni.de
1318411042 A * trapni waves
1318411663 N * Bertl_zZ Bertl
1318411670 M * Bertl morning folks!
1318416363 M * trapni Can anyone in here tell me the big pros (or differences) of vserver versus openvz? the google-source wasn't that reliable on that subject yet :)
1318416542 M * Bertl well, we are providing patches for recent kernels, the patches are drastically smaller and less invasive than the OVZ patches and IMHO the code is better readable ... we also support all kernel configurations (not just specific settings), usually provide good stability and do not limit ourselves to specific platforms, architectures or distributions
1318416571 M * Bertl from the features, it's almost the same, give or take a few ...
1318416593 M * trapni *reading*
1318416700 M * Bertl we do not feature network virtualization (but that's already in mainline and can be used with Linux-VServer), we do not feature live migration (also slowly being implemented in mainline), but if you need this feature, you can wrap the Linux-VServer kernel in kvm
1318416738 M * trapni yeah, that's been my observation so far to (wrt. kernel version support), well, I am pretty new to this company I am working for now, and they use OpenVZ, and I suggested migrating to vserver, since it's pretty much the same but supports more recent kernels (needed for systemd), however, a first look at the vserver websites where really not that promising, full of *old* news, not helping me at saying them, that vserver is actually *active* (they think vserver is
1318416743 M * Bertl arekm: does the new patch/delta fix work for you?
1318416762 M * trapni I also had trouble finding the git repositories for vserver, thus, for openvz, I found on first hit.
1318416798 M * Bertl yeah, well, we do not spend so much time on advertising and/or public relations
1318416817 M * Bertl we have a quite active IRC channel and a quick mailing list
1318416848 M * Bertl the web pages are wiki pages, so feel free to enhance them, the front page should always show the latest versions within the hour
1318416874 M * Bertl (note that kernel.org is still broken, so the kernel links won't work atm)
1318416954 M * Bertl regarding git repository: for the kernel there is none (at least no official one)
1318417307 M * trapni well
1318417331 M * trapni I wonder how the kernel land is developed if there is no official collaboration git source :)
1318417367 M * Bertl http://vserver.13thfloor.at/ExperimentalT/
1318417377 M * Bertl see the delta-*.diff there?
1318417402 M * Bertl those are features, bug-fixes, cleanups, etc
1318417429 M * Bertl they are discussed here and applied/tested/incorporated when considered appropriate
1318417462 M * arekm Bertl: don't know yet. grsec doesn't build and have no idea how to fix
1318417483 M * Bertl okay, keep us updated then :)
1318417498 M * Bertl (or try with the old test kernel and the delta if possible)
1318417693 M * trapni is there a graphical web interface (like proxmox) supporting vserver, too?
1318417817 M * trapni Bertl: are there any plans to push the vserver kernel patches to the mainline tree? or... why don't you?
1318417855 M * Bertl the proxmox folks told me that it would be simple to support Linux-VServer, but they didn't implement it (yet)
1318417888 M * trapni hehe, too bad. but if it's that simple, I guess, it's nothing more than just replacing vzlist/etc with the vserver equivalents :)
1318417888 M * Bertl I think they have some kind of agreement with OVZ not to do it, but I don't know that for sure
1318417941 M * Bertl we tried to get Linux-VServer upstream, but because of the OVZ vs Linux-VServer, mainline decided not to include either, but instead rewrite the functionality from scratch
1318417991 M * Bertl obviously that's a longer project, and the folks who started it seem to have lost some interest ... but all mainline features and advances in this direction are almost immediately incorporated in Linux-VServer 
1318418003 M * trapni "but instead rewrite the functionality from scratch" ?
1318418023 M * daniel_hozac cgroups
1318418029 M * Bertl for example, recent patches use the cgroup system for those areas where the accounting/limits is done
1318418035 M * trapni yeah, like using cgroups and such. I highly appreciate this :)
1318418062 M * Bertl we don't see a point in duplicating functionality unless there is a real need
1318418139 M * trapni yes
1318418193 M * Bertl ah, and I forgot, of course we are not tied to a company selling OS level isolation and virtualization products :)
1318418203 M * trapni Bertl: well, as those guys you mentioned seem to have lost interest, you *might* want to go for second try in getting these patches applied ;)
1318418216 M * Bertl i.e. we do not reserve the 'working' code for the 'paying' customers :)
1318418226 M * trapni Bertl: which might be good and bad. depending on your personal point of view
1318418288 M * Bertl from my personal PoV it's good .. but yes, YMMV
1318418289 M * trapni i would really recommend going the round into again, this might also give you a wider audience and more devs, too
1318418314 M * Bertl do we need more devs?
1318418364 M * daniel_hozac mainline isn't really that interesting these days.
1318418365 M * trapni maybe?
1318418387 M * trapni well, I (for my two cent) would always like to get into kernel development for example :-D
1318418390 M * Bertl I know OVZ claimed (at some point) that over 100 developers are working on their product 24/7 but we can do that in a small group with the same results
1318418419 M * trapni I don't believe that, I mean, they're not even supporting a decent recent kernel ;(
1318418466 M * Bertl regarding kernel development: feel free to join and start working on improving Linux-VServer right now ...
1318418497 M * Bertl patches are always welcome
1318418557 M * trapni is there actually any kind of development roadmap anyway?
1318418620 A * trapni afk
1318418641 M * Bertl after 10 years of development, only a few 'nice to have' features are left unimplemented
1318418676 M * Bertl so basically the development focus is on code review/cleanup/stabilization and of course, porting to recent kernels
1318425016 J * thierryp ~thierry@home.parmentelat.net
1318430986 J * dowdle ~dowdle@scott.coe.montana.edu
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1318437274 M * arekm Bertl: the fix works. thanks! The patch doesn't apply well to 3.0.6 (due to ipc/mqueue.c changes)
1318437526 M * Bertl okay, will look into it later ...
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