1261009600 J * Mr_Smoke_ ~smokey@layla.lecoyote.org
1261009617 Q * Mr_Smoke Read error: Connection reset by peer
1261011779 Q * jrklein Quit: jrklein
1261012184 J * FireEgl FireEgl@173-16-9-10.client.mchsi.com
1261013937 J * emcepe ~mcp@wolk-project.de
1261014197 Q * Loki|muh Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261014304 J * Loki|muh ~loki@satanix.de
1261014358 Q * mcp Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261014358 N * emcepe mcp
1261014377 M * Bertl off to bed now ... have a good one everyone!
1261014396 N * Bertl Bertl_zZ
1261015231 Q * FireEgl Remote host closed the connection
1261015768 Q * faheem Remote host closed the connection
1261016717 J * Waddymelon ~Nigbuntoo@200.76.241.56.dsl.dyn.telnor.net
1261016759 Q * Waddymelon autokilled: Do not spam other people. Mail support@oftc.net if you feel this is in error. (2009-12-17 02:25:59)
1261017678 Q * Hunger Quit: _._
1261017986 Q * _nono_ Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261018008 J * _nono_ ~gomes@libation.ircam.fr
1261018413 J * Hunger ~Hunger@Hunger.hu
1261021589 J * jrklein ~jrklein@2001:0:53aa:64c:0:5ae5:b4d8:690
1261022010 J * Mr_Smoke ~smokey@layla.lecoyote.org
1261022048 Q * Hunger charon.oftc.net joule.oftc.net
1261022048 Q * kiorky charon.oftc.net joule.oftc.net
1261022048 Q * blues charon.oftc.net joule.oftc.net
1261022048 Q * thierryp charon.oftc.net joule.oftc.net
1261022048 Q * arekm charon.oftc.net joule.oftc.net
1261022048 Q * hijacker__ charon.oftc.net joule.oftc.net
1261022048 Q * Piet charon.oftc.net joule.oftc.net
1261022090 J * Hunger ~Hunger@Hunger.hu
1261022090 J * kiorky ~kiorky@cryptelium.net
1261022090 J * blues ~blues@abo252.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl
1261022090 J * thierryp ~thierry@home.parmentelat.net
1261022090 J * arekm arekm@carme.pld-linux.org
1261022090 J * hijacker__ ~hijacker@213.91.163.5
1261022090 J * Piet ~Piet__@659AAAAWC.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net
1261022128 Q * Mr_Smoke_ Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261022434 J * saulus_ ~saulus@d003004.adsl.hansenet.de
1261022846 Q * SauLus Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261022850 N * saulus_ SauLus
1261024251 J * fback_ fback@red.fback.net
1261024251 Q * fback Read error: Connection reset by peer
1261026979 Q * hparker Quit: Read error: 104 (Peer reset by connection)
1261028238 J * daniel_hozac ~daniel@c-9b3171d5.08-230-73746f22.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se
1261029456 Q * Piet Remote host closed the connection
1261031767 J * ghislain ~AQUEOS@LPuteaux-151-41-11-129.w217-128.abo.wanadoo.fr
1261032633 J * Mr_Smoke_ ~smokey@layla.lecoyote.org
1261032650 Q * Mr_Smoke Read error: Connection reset by peer
1261032807 J * FireEgl FireEgl@2001:470:e056:1:223:54ff:fe89:b207
1261033278 J * kir ~kir@swsoft-msk-nat.sw.ru
1261033746 Q * derjohn_mob Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261034117 J * geb ~geb@earth.gebura.eu.org
1261034190 M * geb hi
1261034272 Q * thierryp Remote host closed the connection
1261035035 J * sharkjaw ~gab@90.149.121.45
1261036011 Q * niki Read error: Connection reset by peer
1261036656 J * friendly ~friendly@ppp118-209-31-140.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net
1261037676 J * thierryp ~thierry@zankai.inria.fr
1261037740 J * thierryp_ ~thierry@zankai.inria.fr
1261037740 Q * thierryp Read error: Connection reset by peer
1261038051 Q * nenolod Quit: Leaving
1261038068 J * derjohn_mob ~aj@213.238.45.2
1261039172 J * yarihm ~yarihm@80-219-173-19.dclient.hispeed.ch
1261039283 J * gnuk ~F404ror@pla93-3-82-240-11-251.fbx.proxad.net
1261040036 Q * derjohn_mob Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261040048 J * derjohn_mob aj@18.45.69.80.in-addr.net-lab.net
1261040083 J * bonbons ~bonbons@2001:960:7ab:0:2c0:9fff:fe2d:39d
1261040127 Q * thierryp_ Remote host closed the connection
1261040439 Q * yarihm Quit: This computer has gone to sleep
1261041730 J * davidkarban ~david@80.250.18.198
1261041801 J * yarihm ~yarihm@office-zrh.youngsolutions.ch
1261042155 J * nenolod ~nenolod@petrie.dereferenced.org
1261042477 Q * Mr_Smoke_ Read error: Connection reset by peer
1261042494 J * Mr_Smoke smokey@layla.lecoyote.org
1261042976 Q * friendly Quit: Leaving.
1261043116 J * barismetin ~barismeti@zanzibar.inria.fr
1261046997 N * Bertl_zZ Bertl
1261047001 M * Bertl morning folks!
1261047113 M * kezar hi
1261047191 J * thierryp ~thierry@zankai.inria.fr
1261048179 M * ghislain hi
1261048344 M * mrjack hi Bertl
1261049186 Q * DreamerC Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261050206 Q * SpComb Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261050267 Q * thierryp Remote host closed the connection
1261050294 J * thierryp ~thierry@zankai.inria.fr
1261050338 J * DreamerC ~DreamerC@122-116-181-118.HINET-IP.hinet.net
1261051126 J * takeru ~takeru@nttkyo361056.tkyo.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp
1261051255 J * niki ~niki@0x5553169c.adsl.cybercity.dk
1261051608 Q * takeru Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261051733 M * kezar any drawbacks to setting /tmp on the hdd in guests ?
1261051768 J * takeru ~takeru@nttkyo516096.tkyo.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp
1261051895 Q * takeru 
1261051906 Q * barismetin Remote host closed the connection
1261052031 M * Bertl kezar: well, lower performance, by default no restriction (the latter might be considered an advantage)
1261052090 M * kezar I just want to keep my memory ;) obviously hdd access is slower
1261052231 M * Bertl low memory setup?
1261052257 M * kezar only 2G for the whole machine
1261052269 M * Bertl how many guests?
1261052298 M * kezar 1 for the moment, with web services
1261052330 M * Bertl so that would be 0.7% for tmp at most then :)
1261052381 M * kezar yeah but 16M may not be enough
1261052400 M * Bertl that's what /var/tmp is for ...
1261052536 M * kezar I'll put the tmp dir in the vhost directory for each vhost, in fact you're right I often use /tmp to build things but this won't happen inside the guest
1261052853 J * jdylag ~jarek@v2162.rev.tld.pl
1261053061 M * jdylag hi
1261053092 M * Bertl hey
1261053099 M * jdylag i'm trying to setup hard cpu limits on 2.6.32 kernel (cfs groups)
1261053149 M * Bertl okay?
1261053159 M * jdylag everything works fine but i found way to hang kernel (server is inresponsible without oops)
1261053182 M * Bertl okay?
1261053192 M * jdylag i setup 2 cgoups, 5% cpu each one
1261053212 M * jdylag on first i run cat /dev/urandom | gzip > /dev/null
1261053233 M * jdylag on second wget http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v2.6/linux-2.6.32.tar.bz2
1261053295 M * Bertl and that hangs your kernel?
1261053304 M * jdylag yes
1261053318 M * Bertl what does the (serial) console log?
1261053338 M * Bertl what do you get (stack wise) when you inspect with magic sysrq?
1261053339 M * jdylag there is nothing on console and in logs
1261053360 M * jdylag keyboard doesn't work, network neither
1261053410 M * Bertl sounds indeed like a kernel bug ... you should try with vanilla 2.6.32(.1) to verify that it isn't Linux-VServer related (which I presume)
1261053432 M * Bertl you need to add the hard limit patch to that though
1261053450 M * jdylag this one? http://vserver.13thfloor.at/Experimental/delta-hardcfs-feat01.diff
1261053495 M * Bertl yeah, but let me get you a new one with the essentials
1261053507 M * Bertl i.e. the upstream patches, to make sure
1261053991 J * geos_one ~chatzilla@chello084115149052.4.graz.surfer.at
1261054133 Q * geos_one 
1261054153 J * geos_one ~chatzilla@chello084115149052.4.graz.surfer.at
1261054565 M * Bertl jdylag: here you go: http://vserver.13thfloor.at/ExperimentalT/delta-hardcfs-v4.diff
1261054579 M * Bertl it's against 2.6.32.1, but should apply to 2.6.32 as well
1261054604 M * Bertl you need to setup the cgroups manually with vanilla and this patch, but the functionality should be identical
1261055065 J * barismetin ~barismeti@zanzibar.inria.fr
1261055130 M * jdylag i'll test it and let you know
1261055316 M * Bertl thanks!
1261057022 Q * urbee 
1261057559 M * jdylag i can confirm problem on vanila 2.6.32.1 + hardcfs patch
1261057570 M * jdylag here is my testing procedure: http://paste.linux-vserver.org/14097
1261057595 M * jdylag as you can see, server stops responding on my second wget on second cgroup
1261057621 M * jdylag my kernel config: http://kernel.tld.pl/config
1261058130 M * Bertl excellent, could you report that to Bharata B Rao please?
1261058160 M * Bertl bharata@linux.vnet.ibm.com
1261058191 M * Bertl send greetings from the Linux-VServer team :)
1261058218 M * Bertl ah, and feel free to cc me
1261058261 M * Bertl he is fairly responsive, so I'd expect to get a reply and fix before the weekend
1261058322 M * jdylag sure, i'll do it
1261058335 M * jdylag thanks for help
1261058407 M * Bertl thanks for testing and reporting back!
1261058600 J * SubZero ~SubZero@chello089076140236.chello.pl
1261059037 M * Mr_Smoke Sitting in a chan and seeing these kind of things happen before your eyes is kinda thrilling :)
1261059068 M * Mr_Smoke Im just thinking "hey, this is what Internet is all about in the first place, right ?"
1261059076 M * Mr_Smoke Yay for us :)
1261059268 Q * snooze Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261059276 M * Bertl yeah, couldn't live without it anymore ...
1261059453 Q * derjohn_mob Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261060099 J * derjohn_mob ~aj@213.238.45.2
1261060160 Q * SubZero 
1261060187 Q * sharkjaw Quit: Leaving
1261062157 J * Piet ~Piet__@659AAACOG.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net
1261062316 J * SubZero ~SubZero@chello089076140236.chello.pl
1261063087 Q * cehteh Quit: Terminated with extreme prejudice - dircproxy 1.0.5
1261063686 Q * BWare Quit: *p00f*
1261063826 J * cehteh ~ct@pipapo.org
1261064278 M * Bertl off for now ... bbl
1261064284 N * Bertl Bertl_oO
1261065379 J * hparker ~hparker@linux.homershut.net
1261065522 J * jpic_ ~jpic@chocolatpistache.com
1261065529 P * jpic_ 
1261065583 J * jpic ~jpic@chocolatpistache.com
1261065591 M * jpic hi, do you recommand openvcp or another solution?
1261065750 J * fLoo ~fLoo@2001:6f8:119b:ffff::1
1261066145 Q * thierryp Remote host closed the connection
1261066178 J * thierryp ~thierry@zankai.inria.fr
1261066411 J * fLoo_ ~fLoo@2001:6f8:119b:ffff::1
1261066411 Q * fLoo Remote host closed the connection
1261066418 N * fLoo_ fLoo
1261066426 M * fLoo re
1261066456 M * fLoo Linux hermine 2.6.31.7-vs2.3.0.36.27-beng #1 SMP Sun Dec 13 18:07:28 GMT 2009 i686 GNU/Linux
1261066463 M * fLoo util-vserver: 0.30.216-pre2864; Nov 28 2009, 18:46:14
1261066465 M * fLoo finally
1261066466 M * fLoo -.-
1261066468 M * fLoo hey Bertl_oO
1261067253 J * snooze ~o@1-1-4-40a.gkp.gbg.bostream.se
1261068206 Q * davidkarban Quit: Ex-Chat
1261068323 Q * geb Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261068925 J * SlackLnx ~SlackWare@a85-139-11-14.cpe.netcabo.pt
1261068990 J * geb ~geb@159.4.82-79.rev.gaoland.net
1261069135 Q * geos_one Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.6b5/20091216212054]
1261069383 Q * derjohn_mob Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261070059 Q * yarihm Quit: This computer has gone to sleep
1261070984 Q * thierryp Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261071541 Q * jdylag Remote host closed the connection
1261071596 M * kezar Bertl_oO > how would you limit the cpu usage for all guests in order to keep ~5% of one of the cpus for the host ?
1261073317 Q * manana Read error: Connection timed out
1261073353 Q * barismetin Remote host closed the connection
1261073354 J * manana ~mayday090@84.17.25.149
1261074170 J * thierryp ~thierry@home.parmentelat.net
1261074769 J * hijacker ~hijacker@87-126-142-51.btc-net.bg
1261074912 Q * FireEgl Read error: Connection reset by peer
1261075695 Q * gnuk Quit: NoFeature
1261075699 J * blues_ ~blues@bqo160.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl
1261075791 J * FireEgl FireEgl@173-16-9-10.client.mchsi.com
1261075818 Q * blues Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261077828 Q * niki Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261078103 Q * geb Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261078370 J * niki ~niki@0x5553169c.adsl.cybercity.dk
1261078995 J * Linus ~SlackWare@a85-139-11-84.cpe.netcabo.pt
1261079353 Q * SlackLnx Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261079723 M * Guy- hmmmm... I'm trying to mount a block device inside a vserver guest without stopping the guest, and it apparently succeeds, but in actuality I'm still accessing the fs under the mountpoint
1261079729 M * Guy- what am I doing wrong?
1261079742 M * Guy- vnamespace -e 78 --default -- mount /dev/encrypted/zspatko_temp /var/lib/vservers/stop32/home/zspatko/sokhely -o noatime,nosuid,nodev,noexec,noikeep,attr2
1261079748 M * Guy- this was what I did
1261079774 M * Guy- maybe the mount namespace id of the vserver isn't equal to its context id?
1261079849 M * Guy- yes, that seems to be it
1261079936 M * Guy- because if I run df via vnamespace -e 78, it shows what is should
1261079961 M * Guy- but if I enter the vserver with xid 78, I see the original fs, not the newly mounted one
1261079979 N * Bertl_oO Bertl
1261079982 M * Bertl back now ...
1261080007 M * Bertl kezar: I wouldn't want to do that in the first place :)
1261080096 M * Guy- Bertl: any idea what I'm missing here?
1261080104 Q * nenolod Read error: Connection reset by peer
1261080124 M * Mr_Smoke Bertl: what's wrong with his idea ?
1261080131 M * Mr_Smoke It sounded good to me
1261080166 J * geb ~geb@earth.gebura.eu.org
1261080201 M * kezar it sounded good to me too :] can you explain why it's not ?
1261080269 M * Bertl Guy-: kernel/patch/util-vserver version?
1261080301 M * Bertl kezar, Mr_Smoke: well, I wouldn't want to 'reserve' anything for the guest, I'd prefer to get whatever the host needs when it needs it :)
1261080323 M * Mr_Smoke I think he said reserve 5% for the host :)
1261080330 M * kezar yep
1261080331 J * nenolod ~nenolod@petrie.dereferenced.org
1261080342 M * Mr_Smoke Need some extra sleep maybe ? ;)
1261080343 M * Guy- Bertl: 2.6.30.5-vs2.3.0.36.14-pre5, 0.30.216~r2772
1261080355 M * kezar 5% of one cpu
1261080361 M * kezar (something like that)
1261080372 Q * nenolod Remote host closed the connection
1261080391 M * Guy- I can upgrade util-vserver to r2885 easily if that would make a difference
1261080404 J * nenolod ~nenolod@petrie.dereferenced.org
1261080423 M * Bertl Guy-: yes, and restarting the guest, of course
1261080461 M * Bertl kezar, Mr_Smoke: why 'reserve' anything for the guest?
1261080472 M * kezar for the host
1261080489 M * Mr_Smoke Bertl: why indeed, when he said "for the host" :)
1261080500 M * Bertl *host I mean
1261080520 M * Guy- Bertl: I'd like to avoid that if possible :)
1261080554 M * Bertl well, your util-vserver did not get the namespaces right
1261080582 M * kezar in order to be able to connect to the host even if the guest uses all the/its cpu time, since I don't have any physical access to the machine the ssh connection to the host is my only way to do things on it
1261080594 M * Bertl Guy-: so, not too much you can do ... you might be able to give excessive capabilities to the guest, enter it normally and do the mount there
1261080606 M * Guy- that sounds like a plan, thanks
1261080633 M * Bertl kezar: correct, and when that sshd requires resource, I'd prefer to give all the resources needed to it
1261080642 M * Bertl *resources
1261080652 M * Mr_Smoke Bertl: does this mean that's the current behaviour ?
1261080773 M * Bertl depends on the config, if you give the guests a priority bias, that is definitely the default then
1261080795 M * Mr_Smoke What bias ? I mean, how ?
1261080796 M * Bertl but to answer the original question, yes, you can do that by correct bookkeeping
1261080828 M * Bertl i.e. assign hard limits amounting to 95% of your system (or whatever fraction applies) to the guests
1261080845 M * Bertl the remaining cpu resources will be idle when the host is doing nothing then
1261080862 M * Mr_Smoke Oh ok
1261080878 M * Mr_Smoke But you're saying that without any limits, whatever's on the host has priority over the guests ?
1261080910 M * Bertl by default, no 'priority bias' (that's a config option), you'll get equal chances
1261080926 M * Bertl i.e. any host process will compete with each guest (as single process)
1261080957 M * Bertl assuming you have 1 process which wants to be run on the host, and 20 guests hogging the system (cpu wise)
1261080975 M * Bertl then you will get (assuming you use the cfs scheduler) 1/21 of all cpu resources
1261081013 M * Mr_Smoke Ok
1261081020 M * kezar that's not a good thing in my case :)
1261081033 M * Mr_Smoke I need to check the flower page again to check for that bias setting then :p
1261081128 M * kezar priority-bias
1261081211 M * kezar hum that only concerns priorities inside the guest, doesn't it?
1261081486 M * kezar if I set it to 15 for example, it will nice +15 every process in the guest?
1261081604 M * Bertl IIRC, it is added, so you will raise the priority with 15
1261081614 M * kezar ok
1261081644 M * kezar but nice is less precise then
1261081653 M * kezar inside the guest
1261081670 M * Mr_Smoke Hm I must have some kind of bias
1261081679 M * Mr_Smoke All my guest processes have at least 15
1261082040 M * kezar I can disable sched_hard it will still work?
1261082080 Q * geb Remote host closed the connection
1261082099 M * Bertl sched_hard is unused with kernels after 2.6.24
1261082132 M * kezar ok
1261082157 M * kezar it seems the docs I find are a bit outdated :)
1261082259 J * SlackLnx ~SlackWare@a85-139-11-87.cpe.netcabo.pt
1261082363 J * barismetin ~barismeti@jua06-1-82-242-159-114.fbx.proxad.net
1261082593 Q * Linus Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261082739 J * geb ~geb@earth.gebura.eu.org
1261083575 M * Bertl kezar: if they are on the wiki, feel free to update them
1261083577 Q * geb Quit: /
1261084637 J * Linus ~SlackWare@a85-139-11-94.cpe.netcabo.pt
1261084873 Q * SlackLnx Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261084922 M * kezar it was on some blogs/mailing lists
1261085156 M * fLoo Bertl
1261085158 M * fLoo u wanna marry me ?
1261085164 M * fLoo pls !11
1261085335 Q * hijacker Quit: Leaving
1261085713 Q * Linus Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261085784 Q * niki Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261085862 Q * barismetin Quit: Leaving...
1261086125 M * Bertl fLoo: no, why?
1261086291 J * niki ~niki@0x5553169c.adsl.cybercity.dk
1261086348 M * Guy- is that the most unusual request in this channel so far? :)
1261086422 M * ghislain bertl: to have free vserver support at hand of course !
1261086423 M * ghislain :)
1261086470 M * Guy- I think there are more people who get free vserver support from Bertl than there are people who get paid-for support from him :)
1261086480 M * ghislain bertl: love letter, you are beautifull like an token bucket, your heart is dlimitless...
1261086487 M * Guy- and I'm almost certain he isn't married to most of them :)
1261086489 M * ghislain lol yes
1261086502 M * ghislain the real important part is..at hand
1261086504 M * Bertl :)
1261086505 M * ghislain :)
1261086559 M * fLoo Bertl : dunno, you impersonate a geek
1261086560 M * fLoo <3 ;)
1261086590 M * fLoo whatever, just wanted to share some love
1261086594 M * fLoo its christmas guys :-)
1261086720 J * derjohn_mob ~aj@c145118.adsl.hansenet.de
1261086722 M * Guy- fLoo: I know it's impolite to inquire about such thins, but in this case it may be relevant - are you actually of the female persuasion? :)
1261086742 M * fLoo no, sorry for that (haha)
1261086792 M * Guy- I'm sorry it's through no fault of yours :)
1261086795 M * Guy- *sure
1261086797 M * Guy- not sorry
1261087037 M * fLoo yay :-)
1261087053 M * fLoo and this was just a part of me
1261087065 M * fLoo i consist of somehow a thousand virtualized "fLoo"s
1261087066 M * fLoo :-)
1261087081 M * ghislain is that waht we call a FlooD
1261087326 Q * cuba33ci Read error: Connection reset by peer
1261087335 M * fLoo yep =)
1261087764 Q * ghislain Quit: Leaving.
1261088741 M * fLoo btw
1261088748 M * fLoo i am wondering how common is linux-vserver
1261088760 M * fLoo are there and statistics how often its beeing used ?
1261089319 J * imcsk8 ~ichavero@evdomip-60-8.iusacell.net
1261089336 M * Bertl I guess it is still a niche as we do not spend any time or money on advertisements or marketing, and besides opinion polls on various sites, I don't think there are many
1261089499 M * kezar good software advertises itself
1261089739 M * Bertl yeah, well, still good advertisement even sells windows :)
1261089758 M * fLoo lol
1261089771 M * fLoo well i dont know why so many people use openvz
1261089779 M * kezar yeah
1261089790 M * kezar seems to be crap compared to vserver
1261089793 M * fLoo i was with xen, vmware, openvz and linux-vserver
1261089807 M * fLoo and the best result i had in speed and performance was within linux-vserver
1261089840 M * fLoo vmware is cool, sure, with nice gui apps for remote administration but i can do the same with a few 100 lines of bashscripts
1261089941 M * kezar who needs gui nowadays ;)
1261089976 M * fLoo dunno
1261089977 M * kezar even ms added a cli-only version to their latest windows
1261089978 M * fLoo lazy admijs
1261089980 M * fLoo *admins
1261089996 M * fLoo why do people use software such as plesk / confixx / webmin and stuff
1261090002 M * fLoo cause they like nice graphics and stuff
1261090025 M * fLoo i prefer software i know and which is reliable and stable
1261090042 M * fLoo and thats what i write on my own
1261090065 M * kezar I won't say that, in my company we used to use plesk (I was not here when they set it up), and it was because they wanted to manage things themselves
1261090090 M * fLoo ya, its pretty nice to manage a decent amount of website
1261090091 M * fLoo *s
1261090105 M * kezar it takes time for people to realize that administration is not that easy even with a frontend
1261090112 M * fLoo but as i said, i manage 41 domains with lighttpd just over bash
1261090127 M * fLoo and its as fast as i would use plesk
1261090141 M * fLoo i tested plesk (1-domain-free-license) and its crap in my eyes
1261090154 M * fLoo the time i need to click through the interface is the same i start a bash script lol
1261090175 M * kezar you don't know anything more with a gui than without it, they still do crap with dns I had to correct everything
1261090219 M * fLoo lol
1261090224 M * fLoo dns with gui - pervert
1261090272 M * kezar but well, in a small company people can't do anything when the admin isn't available, this is the reason why people use guis and fire the admin
1261090303 M * fLoo and rehire them if something went wrong - true
1261090318 M * kezar yep
1261090349 M * kezar and the admin commits suicide when he sees the server
1261090582 M * fLoo haha
1261090918 J * yarihm ~yarihm@80-219-173-19.dclient.hispeed.ch
1261091132 Q * yarihm 
1261091205 Q * imcsk8 Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1261091423 J * cuba33ci ~cuba33ci@118-160-167-185.dynamic.hinet.net
1261093289 M * fLoo WARNING: you are going to use an rpm-based installation method without
1261093289 M * fLoo having an 'initpre' script. Such a script is highly recommend to
1261093289 M * fLoo workaround bugs in rpm which can cause messages like
1261093301 M * fLoo what todo when trying to setup centos / fedora guest on a debian host ?
1261093559 M * Guy- the only way I've ever done that so far was to migrate existing physical hosts into vservers
1261093600 M * fLoo kk
1261093608 M * fLoo will use virtualbox then to create new images
1261093735 Q * bzed Quit: üüüüääääääääöööö!
1261093816 J * bzed ~bzed@devel.recluse.de
1261093993 Q * cuba33ci Remote host closed the connection
1261094007 J * cuba33ci ~cuba33ci@118-160-167-185.dynamic.hinet.net
1261094138 Q * SubZero Read error: Connection reset by peer
1261094161 M * Bertl fLoo: rpm/yum can be installed on debian, although the distro make it somewhat hard
1261094183 M * Bertl but yeah, creating and then cleaning up an image with kvm/qemu/virtualbox is fine
1261094184 M * Guy- rpm can be installed trivially on Debian
1261094205 M * Bertl just that it doesn't work out of the box, IIRC :)
1261094221 M * Guy- "work" as in...? :)
1261094234 M * Guy- obviously you can't use it to manage the installed deb packages :)