1237680005 M * Keeper Good Project
1237680045 M * Keeper Bertl: Good night! Good luck
1237680244 M * Keeper bye
1237680558 Q * Keeper Quit: Keeper
1237681294 J * tifflor ~chatzilla@220.130.dyn-adsl.customer.ch.easynet.net
1237681314 P * tifflor 
1237681336 N * DoberMann DoberMann[ZZZzzz]
1237681529 J * saulus_ ~saulus@c207048.adsl.hansenet.de
1237681919 Q * SauLus Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237681920 N * saulus_ SauLus
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1237682009 J * DreamerC ~DreamerC@122-116-181-118.HINET-IP.hinet.net
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1237682792 J * DreamerC ~DreamerC@122-116-181-118.HINET-IP.hinet.net
1237684254 J * hparker ~hparker@2001:470:1f0f:32c:290:96ff:fe50:40fa
1237684257 Q * dna Quit: Verlassend
1237688640 N * aaronyy_ aaronyy
1237690814 Q * Slydder1 Quit: Leaving.
1237690849 J * derjohn_foo ~aj@e180193216.adsl.alicedsl.de
1237691184 Q * nou Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237691278 Q * derjohn_mob Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237691501 J * takeru ~takeru@nttkyo210167.tkyo.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp
1237691857 Q * bono Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237692731 P * takeru 
1237695042 Q * hparker Quit: Read error: 104 (Peer reset by connection)
1237695592 J * Piet ~piet@asteria.debian.or.at
1237698602 J * doener ~doener@i59F56A2D.versanet.de
1237698706 Q * doener_ Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237702139 Q * FireEgl Remote host closed the connection
1237703098 J * gcbirzan gcbirzan@wolfheart.ro
1237703115 J * FireEgl FireEgl@173-16-9-10.client.mchsi.com
1237703146 M * gcbirzan Hm. How can one debug why vserver foo start just hangs? I've tried stracing it, but I can't really see anything fundamentally wrong there...
1237704715 Q * FireEgl Remote host closed the connection
1237704996 J * joss ~joss@58.171.152.125
1237705222 M * joss wonder if anyone done patches aagains mm trees?
1237705226 M * joss against
1237705360 Q * aaronyy Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237705562 J * FireEgl FireEgl@173-16-9-10.client.mchsi.com
1237706340 Q * joss Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237706515 M * cehteh gcbirzan: there is a debug option (forgot how to invoke it --debug? ..)
1237706530 M * cehteh but its very useful to debug such problems
1237707742 J * scientes ~scientes@75-165-16-192.tukw.qwest.net
1237710029 J * takeru ~takeru@nttkyo210167.tkyo.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp
1237710625 Q * FireEgl Remote host closed the connection
1237711441 J * FireEgl ~FireEgl@Sebastian.FireEgl.Com
1237712142 Q * nenolod Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237712340 J * Slydder1 ~chuck@dslb-088-074-045-073.pools.arcor-ip.net
1237712678 J * nenolod nenolod@petrie.dereferenced.org
1237712985 J * bonbons ~bonbons@2001:960:7ab:0:2c0:9fff:fe2d:39d
1237713355 Q * infowolfe Ping timeout: 480 seconds
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1237714951 J * cga ~weechat@94.36.110.25
1237715220 Q * derjohn_foo Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237715773 Q * cga Quit: WeeChat 0.2.6.1
1237716480 J * infowolfe ~infowolfe@c-76-105-242-186.hsd1.or.comcast.net
1237716621 J * cga ~weechat@94.36.110.25
1237716665 N * Bertl_zZ Bertl
1237716674 M * Bertl morning folks!
1237716749 M * Bertl gcbirzan: if it 'just' hangs, it is a good sign, that whatever script is running inside the guest 'just hangs'
1237716788 M * Bertl derjohn: compiles fine here .. need more details
1237717316 J * dna ~dna@53-215-103-86.dynamic.dsl.tng.de
1237717884 J * derjohn_foo ~aj@51.42.69.80.in-addr.net-lab.net
1237717956 M * derjohn Bertl, fs/ocfs2/journal.h:451: error: too many arguments to function ‘jbd2_journal_begin_ordered_truncate
1237718026 J * harobed_ ~harobed@arl57-1-82-231-110-14.fbx.proxad.net
1237718155 J * danman danman@eliza.wigner.bme.hu
1237718281 J * BenG ~bengreen@94-169-110-10.cable.ubr22.aztw.blueyonder.co.uk
1237718322 M * danman Hi guys! I think I have an interesting question. I am thinking of running a virtual environment for webhosting purposes. I really like XEN but I am aware of that OpenVZ and Vserver -based chrooting is much better in performance and other issues (for example: overselling of resources). But XEN is really what I think I need to use, but it would be nice to have vserver running in a XEN-guest. Any thoughts, comments, experiences?
1237718350 M * danman (oh yeah, I think I will have windows guests also, that is a big point next to XEN...)
1237718378 M * danman (and I have been using vserver, it is great...)
1237718416 M * derjohn danman, I use it exactly the way you are describing
1237718431 M * danman wow
1237718432 M * derjohn I run xen domU in PV mode. 
1237718439 Q * BenG 
1237718453 M * derjohn in the domU I run a vserver enabled kernel
1237718467 M * danman sounds great so far
1237718468 M * derjohn so: n-many vservers in a domu, n-many domUs on the host
1237718509 M * danman tell me about performance, or maybe other scenarios you tested earlier and do you think this is the best for you?
1237718523 M * danman I am really in the phase of planning my hardware and architecture
1237718537 M * danman I do not want to make big mistakes :-)
1237718578 M * danman this will be a webhosting environment, but my goal would be to seperate some overkilling users (mostly free users for testing purposes)
1237718601 M * derjohn for some time I provide debianized kernels with vserver, http://blog.derjohn.de/space/start/2006-11-27/3, currently I provide a PV/xen + vserver enabled kernel (look for the 100hz)
1237718614 M * derjohn ah, lenny now, not sid
1237718616 M * danman I have been running a webhosting for 4 years now, 2 yesars with vserver, good results, but now I want to have a high-availability solution with a new server (and using the old one too)
1237718642 M * derjohn danman, well, do you really need xen in between ?
1237718653 M * danman well, windows might be needed
1237718657 M * derjohn why not vserver-ing on the host? works fine here, too
1237718659 M * danman this is a future thought
1237718668 M * derjohn on the same host windows domU?
1237718675 M * danman yes
1237718690 M * danman maybe future clients may come with exchange support etc
1237718696 M * danman I do not want to limit myself
1237718697 M * derjohn I have to admit (sadly) that we also have one 2k3 and one xp domU in the farm
1237718716 M * danman why sadly? :-)
1237718723 M * derjohn that why I went the way putting vservers in domUs
1237718734 M * danman I understand
1237718757 M * derjohn because im sturggeling for years now to get rid of windows ... I leave that market happily to others
1237718774 M * danman but on the other hand, the overkilling issue might be easier to setup with more domus than with vserver
1237718779 M * derjohn but: the windows domU are maintained by the customers themselve
1237718780 M * derjohn s
1237718785 M * danman I would use vserver for things like php5 and php4 
1237718800 M * derjohn overkilling ?
1237718806 M * danman well
1237718809 M * derjohn =overcommitting ?
1237718812 M * danman maybe :-)
1237718821 M * danman a no-end mysql cycle
1237718831 M * danman kills everything
1237718836 M * danman in the host also
1237718842 M * danman maybe these are only setup issues
1237718847 M * derjohn you can limit memory with vserver 
1237718848 M * danman (probably)
1237718857 M * derjohn as well as many other resources
1237718866 M * danman but can you limit it as efficiently as withXEN?
1237718892 M * derjohn to be honest: more efficiently, as memory is shared between guests.
1237718893 M * Bertl derjohn: please upload your config to test with, tx
1237718898 M * danman can vserver-based guests be really completely separated?
1237718914 M * danman derjohn: ok, this is what "overselling" means
1237718915 M * derjohn with very current xen you can do dynamic balloning, too
1237718923 M * danman really?
1237718931 M * danman I didn't read about that
1237718960 M * danman if that is true, why would a non-xen-based-scenario be better?
1237718965 M * derjohn I think xen3.3 , but the domU kernel  needs a memory hotplug kernel (windows xp ??? :/ )
1237718971 M * danman :-)
1237718973 M * Bertl okay, off for now .. will be back later (and look into that)
1237718978 N * Bertl Bertl_oO
1237718979 M * derjohn Bertl, I'll upload
1237718980 M * derjohn bye
1237718985 M * danman bye Bertl
1237719010 M * danman so if this dynamic balloning equal to the shareing of memory etc, why not XEN then?
1237719025 M * danman is it still a major resource allocation?
1237719038 M * Bertl_oO danman: a big win of properly used Linux-VServer (over Xen or similar technologies) is that you can share a lot more resources and save resources by avoiding a kernel and double buffering
1237719061 M * Bertl_oO thus you can get about 10-40 times the number of guests than with Xen
1237719061 M * danman yes, that is absolutely true
1237719066 M * derjohn danman, vserver by concept is more resource-friendly
1237719111 M * danman derjohn: but can I completely seperate vservers? giving a vserver guest to right to give 500 load, but not even touching the host or other guests?
1237719142 M * danman this was the main point in forums I have been reading for the past days :-)
1237719160 M * danman of course they where talking about openvz
1237719162 M * danman not vserver...
1237719198 M * danman I just don't know what way to go :-)
1237719209 M * danman I know that if I have windows in mind, I have to go with XEN
1237719240 M * danman but will XEN + vserver give a fairly good solution (win) to what Bertl said?
1237719259 M * danman XEN setup would be: 1. gentoo linux, 2. windows, 3. perhaps another gentoo linux
1237719269 M * danman 1 would have vservers within...
1237719289 M * danman is this far worse than having one piece of host with vservers? :-)
1237719308 M * danman I am aware that the resource allocated to windows is gone..., but ok, I can live with that :-)
1237719325 M * danman since I will plan my hardware accordingly (more ram)
1237719366 M * danman derjohn: I understand that you need xen because of windows, but does using XEN+vserver contra just-vserver give you major performance problems?
1237719387 M * derjohn danman, yes, it will work that way ... I can prove it, as my customers are paying for the windows domU as well as vserver guests :)
1237719396 M * danman :)
1237719399 M * danman but what about performance?
1237719400 M * danman :-)
1237719415 M * derjohn danman, there is no current kernel that has "vserver+dom0" 
1237719426 M * derjohn debian etc had such a one, lenny doesnt have 
1237719431 M * danman so if we lower the memory and processors of just-vserver with the one dedicated to windows in the other setup, are they almost the same?
1237719448 M * danman hmm
1237719449 M * derjohn xen is always a little (2 years?) behind the curreent kernel
1237719470 M * derjohn luckily, debian lenny provides a self-made 2.6.26-xen
1237719470 M * danman ok, I never used XEN before, these are issues that will probably give me headaches :-)
1237719474 J * Keeper longhorn40@94.51.228.90
1237719492 M * derjohn danman, on prossbile alternative is using vmware-server 
1237719496 M * danman and I am a gentoo fan, not debian, that might also give me problems
1237719507 M * derjohn I remember it builds as kernel module
1237719516 M * derjohn should work on a vserver kernel, too
1237719531 M * danman derjohn: vmware server is a joke :-)
1237719532 M * derjohn also, there are pure foss management tools for vmware-serer 
1237719537 M * derjohn why?
1237719540 M * danman that is not an option
1237719550 M * danman or are you talking about esx?
1237719561 M * danman oh no, you are not
1237719562 M * danman well
1237719569 M * danman I have vmware server setups
1237719573 M * sid3windr virtualbox? :)
1237719575 M * danman I also had vmware server before vserver
1237719576 M * derjohn well, if you are planning a new (w)infrastructure , you should look at that option
1237719583 M * derjohn yes, and virtualbox, too
1237719586 M * danman :-)
1237719594 M * danman I looked into many options
1237719596 M * danman kvm
1237719600 M * danman etc
1237719614 M * derjohn Try to go through the world not-narrow-minded ;)
1237719618 M * Keeper hi
1237719627 M * danman :-)))))
1237719631 M * derjohn I use kvm on my laptop to run a virtual winXP
1237719634 M * danman derjohn: I have experience with vmware server
1237719637 M * danman really?
1237719638 M * danman :-)
1237719647 M * danman what is you opinion about kvm?
1237719651 M * derjohn danman, bad experienece ? did the clock go wrong ?
1237719660 M * danman yup :-)
1237719673 M * sid3windr vmware server and clock = disaster =)
1237719676 M * danman vmware server I think is not the way to go
1237719680 M * danman :-)
1237719683 M * danman for me...
1237719688 M * derjohn danman, kvm rocks, but the management tools have been not friendly
1237719688 M * danman for desktop it is ok
1237719697 M * danman yeah, that is an important issue
1237719700 M * derjohn (with virtsh / libvirt that might have changed)
1237719700 M * danman I am not a developer :-)
1237719717 M * derjohn sid3windr, will with vmware-server 2 ?
1237719739 M * danman derjohn: one questoin
1237719743 M * danman do you think that
1237719747 M * derjohn sid3windr, currently I planned to have a look sat it, as my experience is 1+ yr. back
1237719764 M * danman your current setup (XEN with Windows and Linux-vserver) is much worse than havein a linux-vserver installation?
1237719778 M * danman in performance and hardware-usage
1237719788 M * danman if you don't count with the resources eaten by windows of cours
1237719789 M * danman e
1237719791 M * derjohn danman, my problem with xen is, that I feel since they are bought by citrix,  the future is unclear ...
1237719797 M * Keeper Bertl_oO: Hi
1237719803 M * danman hmm
1237719813 M * derjohn danman, performance is super
1237719822 M * danman you would say the same almost?
1237719831 M * danman whether I go with plan A or plan B?
1237719832 M * danman ;-)
1237719863 M * danman this is a very important question
1237719868 M * derjohn danman, hm, paravirt (PV) is faster than HVM.
1237719874 M * Keeper Bertl_oO: I have good news...
1237719880 M * danman yeah, I read about that
1237719905 M * danman derjohn: and to go further, I want a high-availability solution with my old server...
1237719911 M * derjohn I cannot give you numbers ... comparsionm native vs. xenalized speed or such
1237719914 M * derjohn ask in äxen
1237719916 M * derjohn #xen
1237719920 M * danman maybe XEN has software to do this in virtual-based style :-)
1237719929 M * danman okay
1237719956 M * danman derjohn: thanks very much, it is nice to know that someone uses this approach and thanks for all the contributions you but on you page!!! I will have a look into them!
1237719972 M * Keeper Has changed Vmware Server 2?
1237719973 M * derjohn sid3windr, is vmware-server 2 still such a clock-idiot?
1237719995 M * derjohn Keeper, at least vmw2 uses vanderpool/pacifica
1237720030 M * derjohn I think a can be a PV host, too
1237720051 M * derjohn vmware is really behind in getting paravirtops into mainline in a way they like ;)
1237720061 A * derjohn afk now
1237720135 M * Keeper derjohn: It is a pity that the Vmware server is not available in Gentoo
1237720207 J * yarihm ~yarihm@109-51-239-77-pool.cable.fcom.ch
1237720339 M * danman Keeper: what do you mean? :-)
1237720348 M * danman I use vmware-server in gentoo
1237720403 M * Keeper derjohn: wvware server 2?
1237720418 M * Keeper derjohn: in gentoo?
1237720433 M * danman 1 sec (danman)
1237720434 M * danman :-)
1237720468 M * danman ok, not vmware server 2
1237720469 M * danman :-0
1237720480 M * danman you are right
1237720482 M * Keeper derjohn: Oh sorry did not you wrote
1237720558 M * danman there are some ebuilds tough in beta: http://bugs.gentoo.org/199514
1237720559 M * danman :-)
1237720650 M * Keeper danman: I do not want to test I would like to use the stable version
1237720808 M * Keeper danman: You use Vserver for Gentoo?
1237720815 M * sid3windr derjohn: I haven't tested v2 yet :)
1237720824 M * sid3windr don't know if I will :)
1237720859 J * nou Chaton@causse.larzac.fr.eu.org
1237720876 M * danman Keeper: yes, I use vserver
1237720886 M * danman for gentoo
1237720894 M * danman I love it
1237720926 M * danman but now I think I have to move forward because of plans with windows and clustering :-)
1237720946 M * danman but of course I need vserver in the future setup also
1237720950 M * danman because nothing beats that
1237720959 M * Keeper danman: Gentoo Host, and Gentoo Guest?
1237720975 M * danman yup
1237720980 M * danman absolutely
1237721089 M * Keeper danman: You are engaged in assembly stage for Gentoo Guest?
1237721108 M * danman I have no idea what that means :-)
1237721116 M * danman can you rephrase?
1237721131 M * danman do you mean whether I am a developer?
1237721186 M * danman (no)
1237721187 M * danman :-)
1237721223 M * Keeper danman: Sorry for my English, I am from Russia and speak bad English language
1237721250 M * danman noprob, just trying to answer the questions :-)
1237721320 M * danman Hollow is the god of gentoo-vserver I think ;-)
1237721331 M * Keeper danman: Where did you have for Gentoo Vserver Guest?
1237721333 M * danman at least it is his templates that I use (thanks)
1237721378 J * dna_ ~dna@53-215-103-86.dynamic.dsl.tng.de
1237721384 M * danman Keeper: http://people.linux-vserver.org/~hollow/stages/
1237721404 M * danman it just works... :-)
1237721450 Q * takeru Quit: takeru
1237721459 M * Keeper danman: Thank you very much, look for Diversity...
1237721470 M * danman noproblem!!
1237721475 M * danman thank Hollow :-)
1237721533 M * Keeper danman: The developers have done a lot Well done Vserver
1237721641 M * Keeper danman: What is your version of Gentoo for Host Systems?
1237721678 M * danman amd64
1237721703 M * Keeper danman: Gentoo 2008.0?
1237721703 M * danman amd64/2008.0
1237721706 M * danman yup
1237721710 M * danman just had a look ;-)
1237721773 M * Keeper danman: What is your kernel?
1237721787 Q * dna Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237721834 M * Keeper danman: Last stable?
1237721890 M * danman well
1237721891 M * danman yeah
1237721900 M * danman but I use older one too
1237721907 M * danman (I use this setup on more installations)
1237721955 M * danman 2.6.22-vs2.2.0.6-gentoo and 2.6.22-vs2.2.0.7-gentoo
1237722010 M * Keeper danman: 2.6.22-vs2.2.0.7 - last stable
1237722013 M * danman yup
1237722016 M * danman I use both
1237722041 M * danman but 2.6.22-vs2.2.0.7-gentoo with the template I provided above (http://bb.xnull.de/projects/gentoo/stages/amd64/gentoo-vserver-amd64-current.tar.bz2)
1237722114 M * Keeper danman: thanks to that shared experiences
1237722192 M * danman noproblem
1237722402 M * Keeper danman: You may be used when the web panel to manage Vserver?
1237722796 M * danman no
1237722803 M * danman I never used web panels...
1237722817 M * danman altough I am a webhosting provider
1237722822 M * derjohn Bertl_oO, http://paste.linux-vserver.org/12795 , sufficient ?
1237722835 M * danman I do not like the concept of forming your system to a web panel :-)
1237722852 M * danman of course it might have its benefits...
1237722864 M * danman (less work for the admin)
1237722884 M * danman derjohn: what's the project? :-)
1237722921 M * Keeper danman: Show your site
1237722939 M * derjohn danman, hm? currently ocfs2 doesnt compile with my .config and vserver
1237722954 M * danman aham, understand
1237722961 M * danman I have issues with qmail also
1237722977 M * danman never been able to solve it :-)
1237722995 M * danman oracle, wow
1237723019 M * danman derjohn: you are using vserver in major enterprise environments?
1237723122 J * takeru ~takeru@nttkyo210167.tkyo.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp
1237724169 N * DoberMann[ZZZzzz] DoberMann
1237724434 P * takeru 
1237725375 Q * SauLus Remote host closed the connection
1237726541 Q * harobed_ Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237727140 Q * DreamerC Quit: leaving
1237727158 J * DreamerC ~DreamerC@122-116-181-118.HINET-IP.hinet.net
1237728145 Q * scientes Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237728342 J * saulus ~saulus@d063157.adsl.hansenet.de
1237728821 J * balbir_ ~balbir@122.172.62.146
1237729509 M * derjohn danman, yes, I had a least one major enterprise whose platform were hosted on vserver. But I think they didnt realize that ;)
1237729592 M * derjohn danman, I dont use ocfs2, but I always complile the kernel with everything modular, just on case
1237729725 J * scientes ~scientes@75-165-16-192.tukw.qwest.net
1237730163 Q * derjohn_foo Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237731027 J * bono bono@114-45-226-229.dynamic.hinet.net
1237732050 J * derjohn_foo ~aj@e180193216.adsl.alicedsl.de
1237733353 Q * doener Quit: leaving
1237734098 J * doener ~doener@i59F56A2D.versanet.de
1237735252 Q * Piet Quit: Piet
1237735356 J * harobed_ ~harobed@arl57-1-82-231-110-14.fbx.proxad.net
1237735464 J * Piet ~piet@asteria.debian.or.at
1237736496 M * gcbirzan Bertl_oO, cehteh: Yeah. I was just being retarded, it was a nss issue with the guest OS.
1237737760 M * danman derjohn: if I have VT support in my server, do I need a patched kernel for xen? #xen channel is very silent :-)
1237738128 M * danman because I will have VT-support, and if I am not wrong, it can run then anykind of kernel
1237738141 M * danman Keeper: perhaps do you have any experience with this?
1237738161 M * Keeper danman: VT not need
1237738163 M * danman thus it would not need any patching, I can use gentoo vserver kernel happilty
1237738184 M * danman then with VT it is fairly simple to use XEN, right?
1237738185 M * danman ;-)
1237738194 M * danman also vserver
1237738200 M * danman with gentoo...
1237738286 M * Keeper does not need the support of Intel VT
1237738317 M * danman I understand that
1237738328 M * danman but if I have no support I read that I need kernel patch
1237738336 M * danman but if I have support for INtel VT, no patch is needed?
1237738394 M * nox you need patched guests then
1237738479 M * Keeper But in new versions of the kernel already includes support for domU
1237738498 M * danman wow, ok
1237738498 M * danman thx
1237738682 M * Keeper danman: no promlem
1237740785 J * aaronyy ~aaronyy@cpe-72-225-191-236.nyc.res.rr.com
1237742631 M * Keeper danman: You are using LVM?
1237743593 M * danman no
1237743597 M * danman just simple raid1
1237743615 M * danman Keeper: I have read about XenServer 5, and it being free soon (few days)
1237743625 M * danman is that good stuff, ever tried it?
1237743625 M * danman :-)
1237743773 M * Keeper danman: Just want to use LVM for the allocation of the disk to DomU
1237743828 M * danman hmm, ok, no experience with that
1237743980 M * Keeper danman: XenServer 5 - March 28, should be free, or have already become
1237744888 M * Keeper danman: I do not remember exactly can be mistaken...
1237745445 Q * cga Quit: WeeChat 0.2.6.1
1237746192 N * Bertl_oO Bertl
1237746232 M * Bertl danman: with hardware virtualization support, there is no reason to run Xen, (for linux only guests), you can use kvm instead
1237746235 J * cga ~weechat@94.36.110.25
1237746312 M * Keeper Bertl: Hi
1237746318 M * Bertl hey
1237746359 M * Keeper Bertl: There is very good news
1237746482 M * Keeper Bertl: Linux-vserver.ru owner is willing to give the domain to my enjoyment and to support the Russian draft on VServer, they say that they are ready to cooperate with us and support
1237746504 M * Bertl excellent!
1237746538 M * Bertl I'll setup dns services for that domain
1237746561 M * Bertl all they have to do then is to update the delegation
1237746579 M * Bertl (and we can then adjust the domain as we like)
1237746617 M * Keeper Bertl: They are willing to provide free hosting with a condition of placement of advertisements
1237746684 M * Bertl I have no problem with that, you have to adjust whatever contents management system/wiki you use for that, but that should be simple
1237746766 M * Bertl I can provide them, out of the box, with an entry on the Hall'o'Fame page as sponsor/contributor
1237746914 M * Keeper Bertl: Their advertising is normal, so now I think to the site, design, and so on...
1237747020 M * Keeper Bertl: We want to do that nor whether the original
1237747271 M * Keeper Bertl: I think that they too will want to take part in this case
1237747956 M * danman Keeper, Bertl: thx for the info
1237748010 M * Keeper danman: I'm glad that could help you
1237748439 Q * Piet Remote host closed the connection
1237748515 J * Piet ~piet@asteria.debian.or.at
1237749130 M * Bertl Keeper: okay, basic nameservices (a redirect to linux-vserver.org) is available for linux-vserver.ru with the following nameservers: ns1.linux-vserver.org, ns2.linux-vserver.at, ns1.13thfloor.at
1237749355 M * Keeper Bertl: You want that I sent this domain to your DNS?
1237749441 M * Bertl well, you can use it .. it's just an option, we can easily change that to fit whatever host/ip we want once there is a page available
1237749477 M * Bertl it means that we do not have to bother the folks at marosnet again when we want to change it
1237749604 M * Keeper Bertl: I understand and they understand why we are happy to provide professional free hosting on their server
1237749734 J * ktwilight_ ~ktwilight@91.178.151.225
1237749737 M * Bertl as the idea is to provide a russian page documenting Linux-VServer, and you are going to be the one (as it looks :) to do that, the how and what is your decision ... I'm just providing services we already have ... use them or don't ... as you like :)
1237749843 M * Keeper Bertl: I do not understand you
1237749892 M * Bertl as far as I understood, you plan to make a site for russia (i.e. in russian, for russion folks) right?
1237749935 M * Keeper Bertl: Yes
1237749971 M * Bertl okay, so it's basically your decision where to host it, and what to put on those pages
1237750000 M * Bertl all I provided is a DNS entry you can use, if you like
1237750018 Q * ktwilight Ping timeout: 480 seconds
1237750029 M * Bertl i.e. it is a matter of seconds to change where it points (if the root nameservers use the dns entries)
1237750058 M * Bertl doesn't mean that you have to use that, it's fine if you manage that with the folks at marosnet
1237750197 M * Keeper Bertl: But I think that gives your domain to be used only because it remains under their administration
1237750364 M * Keeper Bertl: Formally, the domain remains for them so they propose the use of its hosting
1237750426 M * Bertl as I said, fine for me too ...
1237750484 M * Keeper Bertl: For what?
1237750527 M * Bertl means: do what you consider appropriate ...
1237750640 M * Keeper Bertl: Here's why I wanted to buy a domain that would most be operated, but I think they are unlikely to yield control DNS. Because this domain of their property and it is unlikely that they want to melt it
1237750730 M * Bertl well, you assumed that they wouldn't cooperate in the first place, no?
1237750798 M * Bertl I would simply tell them, that we do the advertisement they would like to see (as long as it is somewhat appropriate) and that it would be best to delegate the domain to 'our' DNS servers, so that we do not need to bother them when we change something
1237750837 M * Bertl again, worst thing that could happen is that they say: sorry can't do ...
1237750961 M * Keeper Bertl: And why they do not cooperate, they bought the domain for the same purpose that I wanted to buy. And now they have agreed only because it did not lose, that is me, they can always ask to go and put your site at this address
1237751040 M * Keeper Bertl: In the case of cooperation with them, we must obey their rules because of the fact that it is their domain...
1237751184 M * Keeper Bertl: So I also think a bit about what that would be meaningful to work on site if at any time may be asked to withdraw from this domain...
1237751261 M * Bertl as I said, talk to them, tell them about your worries .. solutions usually arise from folks talking with eachother ... not from speculations :)
1237751469 M * Keeper Bertl: I just can not understand why you need that for this domain is for if your DNS, the ISP will provide us with hosting, along with the domain... So will the same FTP access that would be a site to manage
1237751496 M * Bertl yes, that is because you 'didn
1237751510 M * Bertl 't understan' what I said .. literally
1237751535 M * Bertl to put it simple: I'm prefectly fine with them providing the hosting and dns, if that is fine for you
1237751605 M * Bertl if that isn't what you want, then talk to them, we can do the dns and hosting too
1237751782 M * Keeper Bertl: I'm not complaining, they will provide professional hosting in Russia, what more can be desired?
1237751813 M * Bertl so, perfect ... use it :)
1237751835 Q * pmenier Quit: Konversation terminated!
1237751958 M * Keeper Bertl: I will make Russian site so it can see what I am, but I am sure you will advise
1237751995 M * Bertl on the technical part, no problem, on the russian part, you're alone
1237752080 M * Keeper Bertl: 	This is not scary when you can ask all you need from the very founder of the project ;)
1237752125 M * Bertl that's actually wrong :) the project was founded by a canadian, I'm just maintaining it since 6+ years :)
1237752155 M * Bertl (but yeah, there is no line of code left from that area :)
1237752249 M * Keeper Bertl: Yes, I read your interview where you talked about this
1237752412 M * Keeper Bertl: In any case, you know what was being done for yourself... In fact I am so surprised how you manage the project
1237752595 M * Keeper Bertl: But you're right if you say that it is not satisfied in how I come to the commitment to a Russian site about Vserver
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1237759736 M * Bertl derjohn: ping?
1237760167 M * derjohn_foo Bertl, re-ping
1237760184 M * Bertl hey, just built with the fragment of your config ... everything went smoothly
1237760214 M * derjohn_foo hummm ... 
1237760218 M * Bertl btw, why do you enable the CONFIG_OCFS2_COMPAT_JBD=y ?
1237760268 M * derjohn_foo because I pulled the .config from debian's 2.6.xx and just decided about new stuff via make oldconfig.
1237760286 M * derjohn_foo did you compile with 2.6.28.8 ?
1237760294 M * Bertl nope, 2.6.28.7
1237760300 M * derjohn_foo with .7 everything was fine with my patchset.
1237760304 M * Bertl the version the patch is for
1237760324 M * derjohn_foo uh, sorry for not being clearer ...
1237760326 M * Bertl so you made a fault with adapting it to 2.6.28.8?
1237760356 M * derjohn_foo yes, excatly. I remember there were changed in barriers for fs and jbd in the changelog.
1237760370 M * Bertl okay, well, that explains it then :)
1237760414 M * derjohn_foo ah, but .8 is a must I think. did you look through the changelog ?
1237760433 M * Bertl no worries, I'll update the patch properly :)
1237760509 M * derjohn_foo The error reads like a function call is missing the context stuff ...
1237760568 M * derjohn_foo I can remember that I added nulls for that arguments some years ago (for unionfs), but I've told thats  the wrong way :)
1237760580 M * derjohn_foo ok, thanks! 
1237760635 M * derjohn_foo will you include delta-initppid-fix01.diff ?
1237760684 M * Bertl already included in my tree
1237760728 M * derjohn_foo ok :)
1237761657 M * Keeper bye
1237761664 M * Bertl cza
1237761671 M * Bertl cya actually :)
1237761775 M * Keeper Bertl: Good Luck
1237761877 Q * Keeper Quit: Keeper
1237762712 M * Bertl derjohn_foo: good news and bad news .. which ones do you want to get first?
1237762727 M * derjohn_foo bad ones, pls 
1237762745 M * Bertl 2.6.28.8 is broken (regarding ocfs2)
1237762750 A * derjohn_foo is preparing to disable ocfs2
1237762758 M * derjohn_foo really?
1237762766 M * Bertl i.e. we won't fix it, mainline has to do that
1237762769 M * derjohn_foo so, we can expect a 2.6.28.9 ?
1237762785 M * Bertl good news is, the Linux-VServer patch on 2.6.28.8 is in perfect shape
1237762802 M * Bertl i.e. the problem is not Linux-VServer related
1237762824 M * Bertl I just tried with vanilla 2.6.28.8 and 'your' config fragment
1237762826 M * Bertl same result
1237762842 M * Bertl so, you might want to report that upstream
1237762842 M * derjohn_foo so I cna use the old patch and leace ocfs2 out? (I dont use it currently anyway)
1237762870 M * Bertl yep, your mix should be fine, except for the initpid fix
1237762873 A * derjohn_foo reporting? well, I can post the compiler results ...
1237762895 M * Bertl that should suffice, with a complete .config (or at least the relevant part)
1237762911 M * derjohn_foo why except the initpid fix? Isnt that one fine ?
1237762913 M * Bertl it seems to be related to the quota stuff or the DLM
1237762938 M * Bertl the initpid fix is missing in the 2.6.28.7 patch
1237763045 M * derjohn_foo ah yes, I already added that one.
1237763078 M * Bertl I just checked, disabling the CONFIG_OCFS2_COMPAT_JBD seems to do the trick for OCFS2
1237763105 M * Bertl so you might want to report that CONFIG_OCFS2_COMPAT_JBD is broken and either should be removed or fixed
1237763137 M * derjohn_foo ok - sry that I didnt check that myself, but i didnt expect mainline breaking unbreakable linux' fs ;)
1237763159 M * Bertl remember the 99% rule :)
1237763273 M * derjohn_foo oh, you extended the 80/20 rule to a 99%-one ?
1237763355 M * Bertl yeah :)
1237763471 M * derjohn_foo ok, I'll try a compile run without CONFIG_OCFS2_COMPAT_JBD
1237763489 M * derjohn_foo if that runs' I'll check LKML and try again
1237763503 M * Bertl make that, should work .. nevertheless, please report upstream
1237763527 M * derjohn_foo bugzilla ? LKML post is !enough ?
1237763611 M * derjohn_foo Bertl, http://patchwork.kernel.org/patch/13401/
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